Into the Fringe

[Spiritwind]

From Bernard Guenther's Facebook page (November 2, 2015):

Here's a woman I highly respect, a true warrior renegade who paid with her life for exposing the truth about "the topic of all topics". I've noticed that many people who just recently got into the UFO/Alien topic are not aware of her work and the importance of it. It goes contrary to what many more "prolific" UFO researchers claim, especially in the so-called "New Age" arena that is filled with disinformation.

So this is a little memorial in honor for her courage and work:

Dr. Karla Turner was widely respected in the field of Ufology for her research on alien abduction. A brilliant scholar and professional educator, she earned a Ph.D. in Old English studies and taught at the university level in Texas for more than ten years. But in1988, she and her husband and son endured a disturbing series of experiences and recollections that forced them to recognize that they were all abductees.

Dr. Turner’s alien abduction research was published in 3 paperbacks: "Into the Fringe", "Taken", and "Masquerade of Angels".

Dr. Turner, who was in perfect health and had no genetic history of cancers of any kind, died of an unidentifiable cancer on January 10, 1996, after being repeatedly threatened and harassed in an attempt to force her to discontinue her research. She was just 48. Since then, several other people involved in UFO abduction investigations have also experienced threats followed by highly unusual, fast-acting cancer.

Shortly after her suspicious and untimely death (murder), her publishing company was intimidated into halting the printing of Karla Turner’s haunting conclusions about the alien agenda, their alliance with the Illuminati, and how it factors into the New World Order.

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Quotes by Karla Turner:

“The evidence shows that the aliens do harvest from us in a number of ways, emotionally and energetically as well as physically. There are even reported scenarios of facilities in which human bodies are “processed,” and many such reports come from people unfamiliar with ufological literature.

In every instance from this list, there are multiple reports from unrelated cases, confirming that such bizarre details are not the product of a single deranged mind.These details are convincing evidence that, contrary to the claims of many UFO researchers, the abduction experience isn’t limited to a uniform pattern of events. This phenomenon simply can’t be explained in terms of cross-breeding experiments or scientific research into the human physiology:

• Aliens can alter our perception of our surroundings.

• Aliens can control what we think we see. They can appear to us in any number of guises and shapes.

• Aliens can take us–our consciousness–out of our physical bodies, disable our control of our bodies, install one of their own entities, and use our bodies as vehicles for their own activities before returning our consciousness to our bodies.

• Aliens can be present with us in an invisible state and can make themselves only partially visible.

• Aliens take body fluids from our necks, spines, blood veins, joints such as knees and wrists, and other places. They also inject unknown fluids into various parts of our bodies.

• A surprising number of abductees suffer from serious illnesses they didn’t have before their encounters. These have led to surgery, debilitation, and even death from causes the doctors can’t identify.

• Some abductees experience a degeneration of their mental, social, and spiritual well-being. Excessive behavior frequently erupts, such as drug abuse, alcoholism, overeating, and promiscuity. Strange obsessions develop and cause the disruption of normal life and the destruction of personal relationships.

• Aliens show a great interest in adult sexuality, child sexuality, and in inflicting physical pain on abductees.

• Abductees recall being instructed and trained by aliens. This training may be in the form of verbal or telepathic lessons, slide shows, or actual hands-on instruction in the operation of alien technology.

• Abductees report being taken to facilities in which they encounter not only aliens but also normal-looking humans, sometimes in military uniforms, working with the alien captors.

• Abductees often encounter more than one sort of alien during an experience, not just the grays. Every possible combination of gray, reptoid, insectoid, blond, and widow’s peak have been seen during single abductions, aboard the same craft or in the same facility.

• Abductees report seeing other humans in these facilities being drained of blood, being mutilated, flayed, and dismembered, stacked, lifeless like cords of wood. Some abductees have been threatened that they, too, will end up in this condition if they don’t co-operate with their alien captors.

• Aliens have forced their human abductees to have sexual intercourse with aliens and even with other abductees while groups of aliens observe these performances. In such encounters, the aliens have sometimes disguised themselves in order to gain the cooperation of the abductee, appearing in such forms as Jesus, the Pope, certain celebrities, and even the dead spouses of the abductees.

• Aliens make predictions of an imminent period of global chaos and destruction. They say that a certain number of humans will be “rescued” from the planet in order to continue the species, either on another planet or back on earth after the destruction is over. Many abductees report they don’t believe their alien captors and foresee instead a much more sinister use of the “rescued” humans.

Before we allow ourselves to believe in the benevolence of the alien interaction we should ask, do enlightened beings need to use the cover of night to perform good deeds? Do they need to paralyze us and render us helpless to resist? Do angels need to steal our fetuses? Do they need to manipulate our children’s genitals and probe our rectums? Are fear, pain, and deception consistent with high spiritual motives?”

There is a theory that says abductees who perceive their experiences in a negative way only do so because they themselves aren’t spiritually or psychically advanced. Persons with higher cosmic development have positive alien encounters, so the theory goes, and those who have painful or frightening experiences are merely spiritual Neanderthals. This is a pet theory of researchers who claim that aliens, whether objectively real or not, serve as “mirrors” of our spiritual nature, on an individual or a species-wide basis.

Having worked with so many decent, honest, positively oriented abductees, however, I believe this theory is wrong. It is worse than wrong–it is despicable, as despicable as blaming a rape victim for the violence committed against her. This attitude leaves many abductees feeling doubly violated, first by the aliens who took them and then by the UFO researchers to whom they turn for explanations and help.

Humans have a deep need to believe in the power of good. We need for the aliens to be a good force, since we feel so helpless in their presence. And we need for some superior force to offer us a hope of salvation, both personally and globally, when we consider the sorry state of the world. I think the aliens know this about us–they know that we want and hope for them to be benevolent creatures–and they use our desire for goodness to manipulate us. What better way to gain our cooperation than to tell us that the things they are doing are for our own good?

It becomes clear from these details that the beings who are doing such things can’t be seen as spiritually enlightened, with the best interest of the human race in mind. Something else is going on, something far more painful and frightening, in many, many abduction encounters. As to researchers who claim that the ET’s are here to help us evolve some higher consciousness or that they are here for some other positive purpose–saving our plant, promoting world peace, etc. – I challenge those researchers to incorporate anomalous data into this view.

Theories are starting places for research, not proven conclusions, and UFO researchers must be willing to expand and alter their pet theories according to the data they uncover. It would be wonderful if we could shape ET experiences into something positive, but until the details of abduction encounters–all the details–are given serious consideration, I think it’s dangerous to cling to theories that ignore data that will not fit. We owe it to ourselves to seek the whole truth.

I think we need to recognize that deceptions are employed at almost every level of this interaction to keep abductees from knowing about the actual events and the actual entities involved in these encounters. To me, maybe I’m just a suspicious sort, this implies that there is something they don’t want us to know about and often what seems implied from the reports is that there is something within is, the humans, something of which we can be capable, something of resistance or altering of this scenario that the abductors absolutely do not want us to be aware of. They go to great lengths to program our thinking about our encounters with them; that we are subordinate, that we are helpless, or that we are dependent, or that we belong to them…the list goes on and on. And they go to a great deal of trouble to convince us in every way that they can that we can do nothing about controlling these situations.

The good news is that in a number of cases in the past couple of years that hasn’t proven to be true. Abductees are finding more and more specific instances in which they were able to resist the illusion suggestions in which they were able to say “No” to procedures and in fact when they have been able to break free of actual controls. This to me is a great step forward and I think it’s going to be something growing. With any luck we’re going to find abductees are realizing there are ways to change this entire pattern of activity.

We need to hold ourselves to facts in this field and I think that is extremely important. We should repeat that ten times a day as we go through the work in this area. The problem of course with the abduction phenomena, as with a lot of UFOlogy, is that the nature of the alien activity is designed deliberately to keep us from having much in the way of concrete evidence. Designed that way. It is not an accident.

No matter what the truth ultimately proves to be, we have to go for it! I mean without it we’re like children playing with shadows and we’re ignorant and we’re certainly unempowered to deal with and confront whatever the real entities are behind this masquerade. To take it all at face value is foolish. To take none of it at face value is ridiculous. Investigations into this field….there cannot be anything more important for us to be doing right now than to dig past our wishes, dig past our fears and dig for objective reality and understanding."

– Dr. Karla Turner

Her work is also featured in this film we made:
- UFOs, Aliens, and the Question of Contact
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-Ss-HIhixw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Spiritwind]

I read through this (above) list again, after having not looked at the work of Karla Turner for some time. It was good to re-read, as it reminded me why I feel the way I do. It reminded me of what I know, what I have had to factor in to my world view that was previously not there. It helped me to remind myself of why things are the way they are, and why fighting back in a traditional way will not work. I have literally lost friends because of my expanded world view, although I have gained many more. I have seen friends totally taken over by a darkness, a presence, that has superimposed itself over their original personality. Were it not for the fact that I have been able to share my observations with a handful of also aware people in my life, I would still cling to thinking I just had an extremely overactive imagination.

It has become quite clear to me that some would appear to be more targeted than others, just like a prized herd of any other owned and domesticated species. Certain genetic lines are prized over others, and by that I don't mean "special", although some of the herd may have come to believe they are special. A specialness I could live without, for sure. In fact, we would all be best without. Many of these people develop anomalous health conditions that modern physicians, programmed as they are by the system when they go through the indoctrination school, whoops, I mean education and training required to be sanctioned to "practice" medicine, simply do not have the skill set to adequately deal with.

It would make no sense, unless there was an agenda playing out in the background that even they know nothing about. Yes, there is greed, but even that explanation falls short of the picture that has formed for me in the last few years. I see people arguing over the detail of which lies we have all been told are true. When you really begin to see the truth behind the lies on all sides, you realize that you have known the truth all along. For me, my gut feelings I had about this world that go all the way back as early as I can remember thinking about such things, which was pretty young in my case, were actually right on the mark, as hard as that is to come back around to.

At this time I have come to a place where I feel aware of myself as part of a larger body, much like a cell is part of a larger body. Each cell has a function, a reason for being, and not all cells perform the same function. All cells are needed in the body, and when working properly never have to question whether they are performing the right function, they just know what to do. But when the body has become compromised, cells begin to forget their true function, and can even behave contrary to maintaining the health of the body. Every cell also has its orb of influence, a place where it is supposed to perform that function. It's an organic process that promotes the health of the body and it's well being.

When a function goes awry, the body may even appear to turn on itself. I am not a physiologist, nor a biologist, so the best analogy that comes to mind is the stomach. The stomach performs a vital function, to deal with the food we ingest. It has an amazingly caustic acid that works great to perform this function. For a variety of reasons, whenever that function becomes disrupted, that very same stomach acid can become a problem. And if something comes along with actual intent to release that stomach acid in to another part of the body where it cannot perform its proper function, then the body can be totally compromised.

And that is where I feel we, the larger body of humanity that exists within this field of reality have found ourselves. Something very much outside our general awareness, at least for most, has purposefully been allowed in to our body. But because it comes from a realm not seen by most, it's very existence is questioned by those who have closed down their intuitive side, the part of them that goes beyond the five senses, but also performs a vital function. But that too is no mistake, but directly intended to keep us from recognizing the problem. Because, ultimately, we, in our original state, were, and still can be, highly intuitive. It is our natural state. It is what connects us to the larger body of which we are all a part.

I could blab on in this vein for some time. But the reason I am writing this today is to express how weird I think it is that when I encounter a health condition these days, that doesn't seem to follow a set pattern that can easily be understood and influenced to return to a healthy state, the very last thing I want to do is run to my doctor to have him or her tell me what my condition is and what I need to do about it. It's not that they are bad people in any way. I'm sure most really do feel they are helping others. But they, as a cell in the larger body, have been compromised.

The good thing is, since I have also come a long ways in understanding the idea that everything is connected in an energetic way, and as above, so below, as within, so without, and the connection between the micro and the macro, I know now that I have the power within me to communicate with the other cells of my body. And I can connect with command central, which is not a place, but more like a center point of connection within the whole, where all is know and available and all time lines are in the now. But I have also found at times, on my way back to center, that I encounter nodes of fear that have been created on the various timelines that have kept me stuck repeating patterns of un-wellness. It is a slowly growing awareness of the healing journey actually being a multi-dimensional experience.

I am not there yet, simply expressing my growing awareness along these lines. For instance, my family has a history of especially the women on my mothers and grandmothers side of the family have hearing issues, all of us. I know other things about my family that I won't go into detail about here, but besides being a genetic condition, I get that there is slightly more going on there. Yes, I did get hit about the ears a lot as a kid. I also listened to extremely loud music as a teen and young adult. I even smoked a lot of weed and made a point of holding it in to get a better high, which I'm sure wasn't good for my ears (yes, I wasn't very bright). I also realize that something happened to me as a kid, that I can clearly remember with much greater detail now, that suggests another influence of the other worldly type.

There is technology that is being used to target individuals, groups, families etc. that is intended and designed to disrupt the natural flow of energy in basically all living things. This can result in a slew of anomalous health conditions. I am quite sure I do have tinnitus going on, and most would say, ok, end of story, case closed. But since I actually talk a lot to the people I am around, I have discovered that ALL three of us who see each other every day get very loud ringing in one or both ears, the same pitch, during the same windows of time. It can get so loud that I can hardly hear when trying to engage in conversation. It gets louder specifically during certain types of conversation. And it reduces greatly when I take action with the intent to make that happen. This is just one easy example. But I don't seem to be able to make it go away, except occasionally I will suddenly get an additional sound in one ear at a different pitch and frequency, that will come out of the blue and almost drown out the other sound. When this happens I command it to go away, and strangely, it does.

Now, I don't have a clear explanation for any of this, nor am I encouraging anyone not to go to their physician for any physical complaint, I am just saying what I do. If they want to lock me up for refusing standard medical help, then so be it. I will not likely change my stance on this. But what I am trying to say, is that even knowing all this, what do you do? I mean, I have an ex-husband who really thinks they, the government, is still after him, following him around, spying, making life miserable for him because of a discovery and lawsuit from years ago. It did get him blacklisted from the type of work he was doing. But, he can't even live a semi-normal life because of this. He interprets everything through this lens and reacts in a fearful and paranoid fashion to where he appears quite nuts to all his old friends. There have been times where he moves into thinking even those who really care about him are part of some hidden agenda to "get him".

The funny thing is, I know that not only every phone conversation, every email, every place you even go on the Internet is monitored, but it is even much worse than that. I know that even our thoughts can be read. And that is by both forces that actually want to assist us, like meta cells of the larger body who have retained the correct codes needed to regain health, as well as the invading pathogens that literally want to take over and cause the soul of the body to leave, or only remain in an extremely diminished capacity, just enough to keep it alive.

But I have chosen a different route, because I also remember enough of the multi dimensional lives I have experienced that I know with each remembrance, much like a shamanic soul retrieval, I am taking a part of my self back that was lost at the various points of invasion and trauma. I become more connected to the larger body of which I am but a small part, and access to the knowledge and wisdom of the larger whole. This process seems to assist in strengthening the immune system to cast off the pathogen that has gained a foot hold, at least in this small part of the larger body. And I know many others are actually engaging in the same process, even though they may use completely different language to describe it.

So, what I ended up writing here was completely different than where I actually thought I was going to go with this, but I think I will leave it for now, and come back later if I feel there is any more to say.

Here's to waking up in the dream. May the Shekinah in all of us begin to shine again, to bring light to see where we really are, have been, and may be going. Even when you have laid a rug over beautiful wood floors, and we all know how dirty carpets get over time (really disgusting, having pulled a few out of rentals in my time), you can always remove the overlay, and restore the wood that lies beneath. And I'm ripping out that damn nasty carpet!

[Naga_Fireball]

Thank you and holy shit this is a lot of good material.

[Anders]

Surely there are young extraterrestrial civilizations and advanced ETs. And I can see how the young civilizations are similar to our own at the moment, capable of violence, dangerous conflicts and all kinds of immature stuff. But I can't see how advanced ETs with the power to pulverize whole planets in a fraction of a second can be other than 100% peaceful. Their technology is so utterly advanced (they don't need to experiment on humans) that it in the hands of a young civilization would be like giving a toddler a loaded gun. It won't happen. Young civilizations are in a state of protective quarantine until they/we have matured enough to be ready to join the community of advanced ETs.

Alien abductions, when real, are Milabs, military abductions done by humans here on earth.

I think Steven Greer in the following video (from about 2 hours and 16 minutes) is more cautious than my statement above, not because he disagrees with me but because he has to convince people with a broad spectrum of beliefs.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-w0Odg3k7xM&t=2h16m[/youtube]

[Naga_Fireball]

Good post Anders, I lean that direction myself -- although I've wondered before if kids would be targeted more by off world interests whereas adults fall more under MILAB, altho of course ppl who suffer the latter aren't sure which faction was responsible for things in the past that just seem a bit "off"... @@

[Anders]

Good post Anders, I lean that direction myself -- although I've wondered before if kids would be targeted more by off world interests whereas adults fall more under MILAB, altho of course ppl who suffer the latter aren't sure which faction was responsible for things in the past that just seem a bit "off"... @@

I was wondering why Steven Greer opened up the possibility of alien abductions being done by ETs, but when I listened to his presentation again I noticed his explanation: "you can't prove a negative". I firmly believe Greer is absolutely sure that advanced ETs, those capable of traveling to earth, are peaceful. But instead of endlessly arguing with people who believe in evil space aliens abducting people, he said "I wouldn't say it's impossible".

And it occurred to me that Greer's approach is better than my complete denial of alien abductions by ETs. Because my approach is biased and Greer's approach in the video is more unbiased. But I will stick to my firm belief anyway. Because it fits the big picture imo.

[Christine]

Another piece of Bernhard Guenther's brilliant writing. (copied from Facebook)



All right, going beyond the political circus side show and distraction.....

Anyone who is are familiar with my work (https://veilofreality.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) knows that I write and talk a lot about the Hyperdimensional Matrix Control System (HMCS). What it comes down to is that humanity is not on the top of the food chain and humanity is not in control of itself. The idea of "free will" is in many aspects an illusion. Everything you see on the world stage is manipulated and designed to create this "food" frequency and keep humanity in a frequency prison by forces outside our five-sensory perception, working through us/others (including the elite/controllers on a 3D level) and distracting us by the shadows on the wall/world stage (divide&conquer) and official cult-ure. "Government" (or any belief in authority) is also an "archonic" creation; the perfect foundation to keep people in endless conflict with each other, disempowered and produce all the "loosh" to feed upon. In a nutshell, the HMCS is the totality of forces and mechanisms that aim to keep us spiritually asleep.

Currently these occult forces are on overdrive, trying to lock humanity into a frequency prison (which will be heightened with the dawning of Transhumanism and A.I.) to counter-act the "Divine Awakening Force" during this Time of Transition. Yet, this increase of friction (and it will get more intense) and suffering can serve as catalyst and (inner) alchemical initiation for people to truly start questioning everything they ever believed in and were told/taught by official culture and most importantly to engage in sincere self-work and embodiment practices. The choice, as always, is within each Individual and also depends on his/her soul potential, for not everyone is here to "awaken" in this current cycle (and there is no judgment around that) as we are in the midst of a Timeline-Reality split. This is the apocalypse, which means "un-veiling", not "destruction" and "occult" means "hidden", nothing to do with "evil".

However, this is a "concept" that is really hard for most people to grasp and accept and is most often ridiculed and laughed off as "sci-fi", "conspiracy nonsense" or "mental/psychological delusion" because it's so far out their conditioned beliefs and view of life (by design of the same "force"), yet all the ancient mystery schools, shamanic and esoteric teachings (much of it has been suppressed and distorted over thousands of years for obvious reasons) have conveyed this truth for the ones with eyes to see and ears to ear in their own language and symbolisms, be it "The General Law" (Esoteric Christianity), Archons (Gnostics), "Lords of Destiny" (Hermeticism), Predator/Fliers - "The topic of all topics" (Shamanism, Castaneda), "The Evil Magician" (Gurdjieff), The Shaitans (Sufism), the Jinn (Arabian mythology), Wetiko (Native American spirituality), Occult Hostile Forces (Sri Aurobindo, Integral Yoga), etc...

It is not a "fairy tale", or "superstition". Our entire (modern) civilization and society is a product of this "force"....in fact an "alien" creation which we mistake as "human nature" where pathology has become normalized.

Don't wait for this Knowledge and Truth to be brought to you via TED, Oprah, The NY Bestseller list, mainstream "science", let alone any politician or celebrity-style spiritual gurus....and don't believe me either....find out for yourself, but don't ridicule/judge something or have an "opinion" about something until you have sincerely researched it yourself, which, in this case, also implies sincere esoteric self-work to perceive these forces directly, to "see the unseen" beyond appearances....and to ultimately free yourself from its influence via tapping into your own embodied connection to the Divine and Spirit within, i.e. DNA activation to reconnect with your original blueprint prior genetic modification.

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"There are beings in the spiritual realms for whom anxiety and fear emanating from human beings offer welcome food. When humans have no anxiety and fear, then these creatures starve. People not yet sufficiently convinced of this statement could understand it to be meant comparatively only. But for those who are familiar with this phenomenon, it is a reality. If fear and anxiety radiates from people and they break out in panic, then these creatures find welcome nutrition and they become more and more powerful. These beings are hostile towards humanity. Everything that feeds on negative feelings, on anxiety, fear and superstition, despair or doubt, are in reality hostile forces in supersensible worlds, launching cruel attacks on human beings, while they are being fed. Therefore, it is above all necessary to begin with that the person who enters the spiritual world overcomes fear, feelings of helplessness, despair and anxiety. But these are exactly the feelings that belong to contemporary culture and materialism; because it estranges people from the spiritual world, it is especially suited to evoke hopelessness and fear of the unknown in people, thereby calling up the above mentioned hostile forces against them."

~ Rudolf Steiner [Source (German): Rudolf Steiner - Die Erkenntnis der Seele und des Geistes – Berlin, December 12, 1907]

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“Look at what happened in 1914 – or for that matter at all that is and has been happening in human history – the eye of the Yogin sees not only the outward events and persons and causes, but the enormous forces which precipitate them into action. If the men who fought were instruments in the hands of rulers and financiers, these in turn were mere puppets in the clutch of those [hidden/hyperdimensional] forces. When one is habituated to see the things behind, one is no longer prone to be touched by the outward aspects – or to expect any remedy from political, institutional or social changes; the only way out is through the descent of an [embodied] consciousness which is not the puppet of these forces but is greater than they are.

Men are being constantly invaded by the hostiles and there are great numbers of men who are partly or entirely under their influence. At the present moment they are very active all over the earth. Of course in the outside world there is no consciousness, such as is developed in yoga, by which they can either become aware of or consciously repel the attacks – the struggle in them between the psychic (soul) and the hostile force goes on mostly behind the veil or so far as it is on the surface is not understood by the mind.

The apparent freedom and self-assertion of our personal being to which we are so profoundly attached, conceal a most pitiable subjection to a thousand suggestions, impulsions, forces which we have made extraneous to your little person. Our ego, boasting of freedom, is at every moment the slave, toy and puppet of countless beings, powers, forces, influences in universal Nature. All life is the play of universal forces. The individual gives a personal form to these universal forces.

But he can choose whether he shall respond or not to the action of a particular force. Only most people do not really choose – they indulge the play of the forces. Your illnesses, depressions, etc. are the repeated play of such forces. It is only when one can make oneself free of them that one can be the true person and have a true life – but one can be free only by living in the Divine.”

~ Sri Aurobindo, The Hidden Forces of Life - Integral Yoga

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Recommended reading:

- Timeline-Reality Split, Frequency Vibration and the Hidden Forces of Life
https://veilofreality.com/2016/08/02/ti ... s-of-life/

- The Matrix of Control – Beyond its 3D Manifestation
http://wakeup-world.com/2016/04/23/the- ... festation/

- Hyperdimensional Manipulation and Anchoring a Higher Frequency
http://wakeup-world.com/2015/05/23/hype ... frequency/

- The Hidden Forces of Life by Sri Aurobindo
https://www.facebook.com/notes/bernhard ... 0259538908

- Transhumanism - The Consciousness Trap
https://www.facebook.com/notes/bernhard ... 9722533908

- The Positive/Negative Realms of Higher Densities by Michael Topper
https://www.facebook.com/notes/bernhard ... 7227353908

[Spiritwind]

I guess I should clarify a few things in my previous post. You see, up until just over 3 years ago I didn't have much of a strong opinion about the whole topic of UFO's and alien abduction, because I was quite happy in my assumption that, regardless of whether the intentions were good or bad, or whether they came from the inner earth, under our lakes and oceans, some other planet or star system, some other reality or dimension, or even some other time (and it could be ALL of those), at least it wasn't happening to me or any of the people I knew.

Could some be working with rogue factions of the military? Of course they could. Is it logical or likely that it is ONLY the military and their own genetic mutations and technology we are dealing with here? And I can't buy the "I'm way far advanced in every way from you, so I must be good" either. The evidence really didn't even fit back then, with all the research I had done out of curiosity to at least inform myself about what might be going on, it really doesn't fit now.

For one thing, there is an assumption with this, that while advanced in many ways, possibly intellectually, experientially, and technologically, that all these beings would necessarily be advanced spiritually. One would like to assume that, but it is not necessarily so. In fact, the evidence to date, at least in my mind, strongly suggests this is not so.

But then, I now have to factor in some very personal experiences, that while I can't fully explain them, have put me in a whole new category. What if you had sudden recall, either through dreams and waking visions and downloads, or other methods such as hypnosis or TIR (traumatic incident reduction technique used to often help victims of car crashes get over their anxiety) that suggested that you, too, had experiences that seemed invasive, traumatizing, and created an intense emotional response?

Now, I realize that the technology exists to implant memories as well. But what if you kept going with it, and with each subsequent layer of recall, much like the movie Inception, you experienced a type of healing and release, and sense of empowerment? What if it begins to dawn on you, that the trauma, embedded in your subconscious, below the recall of your waking mind, has been part of what has kept you stuck in self defeating behaviors and perceptions about yourself and your world? What if you begin to realize that these memories go far beyond what you are experiencing in this lifetime alone?

This has all personally happened to me. Plus I have had a number of shamanic types of healing and done a great deal of journey work into nearby spiritual realms. One of these, they call middle earth, is much like our everyday waking reality here, but kind of dreamlike, and not set in the way it is here. Then there is what is called the lower world, that is where you look for the pieces of yourself that have broken off due to traumas that have been experienced. I have had this done, and it is truly powerful life changing work, at least it has been for me.

Then there is the upper world, where you can communicate with beings of a much more ethereal and spiritual nature. Are all these various realms exclusive? My experiences have convinced me otherwise. There are beneficial beings, such as spirit guides of various types to be found in the lower world, and there are spiritual deceivers to be found even in the upper world. So, again, for me, it is about learning to discern energy signatures, as to whether something, a being, has a beneficial intent, or otherwise. And it can get sneaky, too. For instance, I have indeed found that many of the new age teachings, on which I spent a ton of money, were, after all, another form of control and a type of trap to keep me from discovering that all I needed to know was already there inside me, just waiting for the key to unlock.

And I have personally witnessed a non-physical to this world entity literally take over a good friend of mine, to where that person is still in there, but now has a more dominant personality that has taken over and brought about an almost complete personality change. This person seems to be completely unaware. I watched this all play out in real time over a period of about three years as well. And it was heartbreaking to watch. And, it turns out this person and the whole family was, and still is, being abducted. And this case actually has some physical proof to go with it.

So, my personal experiences are what have changed me. Everyone is entitled to their beliefs, but for myself I will not deny my experiences, even if they can't be fully explained, just because they do not fit with what I want the world to look like. Believe me, I would absolutely love to be proven wrong, and that Steven Greer is right. It is just the military doing all these bad things, and what aliens are here (whatever your definition of that is) are all good, because, well, it just makes sense. It does, but only if you don't factor in certain known pieces of information associated with this phenomena.

So if you haven't been touched in a personal way by this phenomena (and just because you don't remember doesn't mean you haven't), then I am happy for you. My reality has changed, and I just can't fit it back in that neat and tidy little box it used to fit in. On the other hand, life is so much more fascinating as it turns out, than I could have previously conceived. And, if the journey is about experience, and learning through that experience, than I have only been enriched by seeing things anew. I'm fairly certain that will continue to change. As I keep pushing the barriers back, and see each of us finding our inner strength hidden within the recesses of our being, it only heralds good things to come. Birth is a messy thing. And I feel nothing short of a totally new level of consciousness is being birthed here on planet earth. Even though I'm not happy to find that the known techniques of traumatizing an individual repeatedly creates the doorway to mind control and alternate personalities that can be programmed, and that it goes far beyond anything that started in our known history, or current lifetime, it's good to know we are learning how to heal anyway, and reassemble ourselves.

But, once again, that is just MY experience. I honor and respect each persons right to their own world view. Somehow it will all come out in the wash eventually anyway.

[Anders]

... I can't buy the "I'm way far advanced in every way from you, so I must be good" either. The evidence really didn't even fit back then, with all the research I had done out of curiosity to at least inform myself about what might be going on, it really doesn't fit now.

For one thing, there is an assumption with this, that while advanced in many ways, possibly intellectually, experientially, and technologically, that all these beings would necessarily be advanced spiritually. One would like to assume that, but it is not necessarily so. In fact, the evidence to date, at least in my mind, strongly suggests this is not so.

I forgot to mention one key thing about why I believe advanced ETs are all peaceful. And that is that the quarantine around young civilizations is impossible to break without the civilizations having reached an evolutionary level of connecting with Source. On a practical level the advanced civilizations have technology that ensures safe operation. It's impossible to use that technology for destructive purposes other than in precisely controlled ways.

It's possible that Star Wars scenarios and other seeming conflicts are going on among advanced civilizations, but as games kind of instead of being serious harmful conflicts. And it's impossible for advanced ETs to break a quarantine from the outside and start performing nasty experiments on younger civilizations and things like that, because the (supremely intelligent) technology doesn't allow it. It's a real Prime Directive that is controlled by the technology itself and not by some Star Trek committees who can decide by themselves whether they want to break the Prime Directive rule or not.

[Naga_Fireball]

Hey Spiritwind, you are such a strong person, to not only be there for her but to try to unravel her mystery. The people who remember "too much" are often most viciously suppressed, because in order to have a story you have to have recalled it.

That is why, imo, our society is subjected to so many memory damaging drugs under the auspices of therapy and prevention of disease. The manner in which the British royal family lock each other up for dissent and emotional trouble is a good example of humans punishing other humans who get in the way of ambition.

Unfortunately we can't choose our mothers. And I mean our society, our birth world. Not my actual mother, who is an amazing person... what I mean is that there's a good chance that the clumsier UFOs and less subtle ETs, if they exist as such, originated from a flawed world like ours. I mean there's a chance that capitalism in some form rules rather than the law as Christ and others proscribed.

At best, this would put us in a situation where we have 3 major ET groups coming from just one world: their evil leaders and military industrial complex, the poor colonists who go along with group 1, and lastly, the freedom fighters and guerrillas.

No need for multiple races of ETs to explain civil war. And discovering a planet with less advanced but equally intelligent life is enough to start a civil war up there.

As Alex Jones might say, God help him, "There is a war for your mind".

The irony of living in this "middle earth" is how much darkness people have to fight through just to get a little light. And sometimes this light isn't even enough to warm us, but just remind us that there is hope and peace Somewhere out there, like Valinor vs. Numenor.

We unfortunately are stuck on Numenor and it's sinking right now.


Regarding the military and especially the corporations... i would imagine that they have resources at their disposal that would shock a humanitarian.

I think though, the most terrible weapon of all, is when they tell people in your own neighborhood to start gaslighting and harassing us. There isn't much worse than being pranked, asked a trillion questions, yet still being no closer to having friends, because 50% of the people who engage are on the wrong side.